Thank you for all your help on this one guys.. one hall sensor later and away it went. Its been a pain becuase its broke down 3 times within as many weeks and each time its been something different- which is good for me - but it fogs your brain!! and theres a high risk of the customer not understanding that it really is Not your fault and you risk losing him. Thanks again... im sure this little lot should help someone else in the future.. regards mike