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Ford Mondeo 2.0 16v 2002 - 5 amp drain - Fixed #

Posted by Job Gevers on December 14, 2016, 5:02 pm

Year of Manufacture *: 2002

Hi all,

Just wondering if anyone has come across this before i take this car to bits. It is actually a car that belongs to my garage.

The car has a 5 amp drain. Pulled all fuses and relays but drain stays. Disconnect alternator and drain disappears. Re-connect alternator and drain does not re-appear until started and stopped. I popped another alternator on but this hasn't fixed the problem.

I am probably really thick but i can't think of what could cause a 5 amp drain? Anyone care to help me find my brain?

Cheers,

Job

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Tony Ludford <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5539' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 14, 2016, 7:24 pm, in reply to "Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Tony Ludford

Does the drain go if you un-plug the alternator 3-pin plug? Or is it the B+.....

Have you volt drop tested between battery and alternator? I wonder if you've got a bad connection of B+ at starter motor? I've had bad main feed wire (B+) between starter and alternator before too..... (volt drop when engine running proves that fault).

Alternatively, 2 pins go to PCM, the 3rd is from the fusebox. Try disconnecting PCM, then fusebox.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 14, 2016, 7:33 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

Hi Tony,

Unplugging the 3 pin plug does nothing to the drain. Disconnecting the B+ at the alternator (or the battery) stops the drain.

No real volt drop between battery, starter motor and alternator when i first checked. I'll check again tomorrow as i haven't checked after replacing the alternator.

Thanks for your reply!

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by andrew young <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5148' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 14, 2016, 7:53 pm, in reply to "Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Andrew Young

What equipment are you using to test for drain,and where in the circuit are you testing.These old Mondeos are bullet proof.Never seen a drain like that.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 14, 2016, 8:16 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

Old Fluke 98 with amps clamp. I did check with a 20 amp multimeter as well.

Exactly, I thought I must be a bit dim not to be able identify the culprit.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Andrew Pethig on December 14, 2016, 10:03 pm, in reply to "Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Edited by board administrator December 21, 2016, 7:46 am

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by andrew young <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5148' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 14, 2016, 10:07 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Andrew Young

At 5 amps,something must be getting warm?

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 15, 2016, 3:59 am, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

Not that I can find at the moment...

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Tony Ludford <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5539' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 15, 2016, 7:40 am, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Tony Ludford

Were you checking with engine running and all loads on?

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 15, 2016, 7:48 am, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

Well, I've isolated the drain to the alternator. I don't quite believe that 2 alternators would produce the same fault though. Is there something i don't know about these charging systems?

With or without the 3 pin plug connected to the alternator the drain is about 5 amps when B+ is connected to the battery. Take B+ off the battery and the drain disappears.

Can anyone shed about 5 amps worth of light?

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 15, 2016, 8:34 am, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"

Just wondering if the Engine control unit needs to switch this alternator on the white and brown wires from the alternator.
Anyone have an idea what i should be looking for on these 2 wires?
With ignition switched off i have an earth on the white wire and a live on the brown wire. As well as a 5 amp drain.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Tony Ludford <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5539' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 15, 2016, 6:04 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Tony Ludford

They should be LIN wires, if I remember correctly. The other wire (orange/yellow?) should be 12v. Have you disconnected PCM? If so, and the drain is still present, there's a short somewhere. If the voltage disappears and drain goes, then the PCM appears to be at fault.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Andy Broomhead <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=ukat3503' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 15, 2016, 8:43 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Andy Broomhead

With small plug off alternator will run in default, still charge but will not be controlled by pcm. It is not switched" by the PCM so if your drain is through the alternator B+ terminal then it is faulty. Where is it from? Not genuine at a guess!

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 16, 2016, 6:57 am, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

Indeed not an original alternator. But the fault is exactly the same as the old one that came off.

I haven't disconnected the PCM yet. That is the next thing. That is why i had the question if the PCM 'disconnects' the alternator when the car is switched off as the drain is also there if the 3 pin plug is disconnected.

I can't believe I am getting beaten by an alternator on an old Mondeo :-)

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Tony Ludford <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5539' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 16, 2016, 6:13 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Tony Ludford

The alternator self-regulates if you disconnect the 3-pin plug. Therefore, I would assume that it will shut off when the engine stops.
Did you "volt drop" test the Alternator B+ to Battery B+ terminal?

(sorry if this is teaching you to suck eggs do you know how to volt drop test? I've had several starter connector wires go green on these, and that's what I believe you have).

Put the volt meter negative lead on the positive terminal of the battery.
Put the volt meter positive lead on the alternator B+ terminal.

Start the engine and introduce some electrical loads (headlights, heater blower, heated screen).
What does the volt meter read? (<0.2v is ideal)

Now try the alternator body to Battery negative. If this is high, look for a bad engine earth. (<0.2v is ideal)

Anything more than 0.5v is a serious issue, 0.2-0.5v is a slight problem.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Fiachra Purcell <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=ukat3006' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 17, 2016, 11:34 am, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Fiachra Purcell

At 5 Amps something must be getting seriously warm.
I use a flir one (thermal imaging camera) for battery drains.
Shows heat differences, even very small heat differences.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 17, 2016, 3:59 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"

Thanks Tony, one of the first things i did... To be doubly sure actually checked with a new wire directly between BAT B+ and ALT B+.

The age of my Fluke 98/Bosch PMS shows how long i've been playing about vehicle diagnostics. Just been out of the game for a while but now have garages again albeit in France. When UKAutotalk started I had a garage in Scotland. (Missing a few people posting from that era, where have they gone?)

As the Mondeo is a garage hack I've decided to park it up till after new year. Hopefully I'll get some inspiration.
I have ordered another starter anyway, even though i can't believe 2 starters having the same fault.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 17, 2016, 4:03 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

A good idea. Just a infrared temp gun doesn't see anything out of the ordinary.
I'll have a look at buying a thermal imaging camera as a Christmas present :-)
Flir is a brand?

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by John Ritchie <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT2638' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 17, 2016, 4:11 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
John Ritchie

Hi Job, if your ordering the Flir one for your phone, i would order the extension adapter if you have a phone case, Flir is good kit though

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Kevin Apps <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT2589' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 17, 2016, 4:11 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Kevin Apps

Job

http://members2.boardhost.com/ukautotalk3/msg/1463040348.html

Kev.

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 17, 2016, 4:18 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

Thanks, that's really good. Which model camera do you think provides best value for money?

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 17, 2016, 4:21 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

Just trying to find out what best to get...

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Graham Bullock <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT2744' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 17, 2016, 11:29 pm, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Graham Bullock

You may find this interesting to help a decision

[url=

Graham

Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v

Posted by Job Gevers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5524' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on December 18, 2016, 9:24 am, in reply to "Re: Old 2002 Mondeo 2.0 16v"
Job Gevers

The Flir One for Android/Iphone is good enough for garage use?

Fixed #

Posted by Job Gevers on December 28, 2016, 12:53 pm, in reply to "Ford Mondeo 2.0 16v 2002 - 5 amp drain #"
Edited by board administrator January 6, 2017, 2:00 pm

Well, as it is a garage jalopy I've decided not to spend more time on this and I've just wired in a relay in between the alternator and B+.

All fine now...

Thanks for all the suggestions.

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