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Vauxhall Astra G 2.0 1998 - Coding keys #

Posted by David Green on July 13, 2014, 3:25 pm

Year of Manufacture *: 1998
( Optional ) Engine Code or CC: 2.0

I coded two keys to the above vehicle a few weeks ago, where I purchased a used transponder chip and cloned it from the original one, both keys have worked fine until now but one key now causes the imobiliser light to flash in the instrument display. My question becomes when cloning these chips can they fail in service without warning, and is it recommended to clone them or buy new?

Do these transponder chips go faulty?

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Mark Carter <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1428' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 13, 2014, 4:30 pm, in reply to "Vauxhall Astra G"
Mark Carter

>>> where I purchased a used transponder chip <<<

Are you saying you brought a second hand transponder by itself and not part of a "kit"

Why not just buy a new one and program it?

What Immo system is the vehicle running?

What is the fault code logged?

Modern cars, Its all wizardry and witchcraft

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by David Green <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=ukat3707' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 13, 2014, 6:24 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"

Yes I bought a second hand transponder, first time I have ever bought one so did not know that a kit was available.

Not been back to the car yet but the customer advises that with the key in the ignition the immobiliser warning lamp is flashing, then putting the second key into the ignition the immobiliser warning lamp works fine. No fault codes been read yet but will let you know. Don't know what immobiliser vehicle is running yet except to say that its the factory fitted one.

Mark you have a lot of experience in this area of the trade, may I ask please, are these transponder chips known for being unreliable in service when cloned?

Thanks for replying

David

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Mark Carter <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1428' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 13, 2014, 8:45 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
Mark Carter

>>> Mark you have a lot of experience in this area of the trade <<<

Far from it, Immo work is probably one of my weakest areas and one of my recent steep learning curves (with still a long way to go) There are far more knowledgeable people than me on this site.

My questions arise because as far as I am aware second hand transponder chips can not be used on Astra G's , it will depend on whether the vehicle is running a Immo 2 or Immo 3 system, but either way new chips are under Â£10 so I don't see the need to use a second hand one? (more knowledgeable people please correct me)

If I read your post correctly, the vehicle had one key that you have cloned with a second hand chip that you have brought and fitted it into a second key blade, is this correct?

If so you know which key has failed yet?

If its the one you cloned then I would be tempted to buy a new chip and just program it in (it takes under 2 mins)

As to your question regarding their reliability, anything can and does fail in service, but I do not find myself replacing them often.

Again perhaps a locksmith on here can enlighten us.

Mark

Modern cars, Its all wizardry and witchcraft

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by david green <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=ukat3707' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 13, 2014, 9:10 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"

Thanks Mark for replying. Apparently I am told that they are a rolling code that changes every 3 to 8 weeks, hence it has just rolled?

I connected TECH II and tried to clone it in the programming module but TECH II says that TIS authorisation is required, so I assume that the ECM has locked out?

I have just been advised that OPCOM will program the transponders but am unsure now if it will because TECH II is requiring authorisation to communicate with ECM, so I assume that OPCOM would require the same?

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Lee Mackintosh <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1348' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 13, 2014, 9:16 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
Lee Mackintosh

I suppose cloning is far quicker and easier especially if you don't have the car pass. At least I've learnt some Astra G keys are cloneable as I have never been able to do it with my old machine but then equipment has come on strong.

thanks
lee

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Mark Carter <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1428' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 14, 2014, 9:47 am, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
Mark Carter

Now its all coming together, you are gleaning bits of info and coming to the wrong answer 2 + 2 = 5

"Rolling" codes are just a step forward from fixed codes (which were easy to "steal" via a remote reader) This should not be your issue.

Tech II will ask for security access when programming a key, Vaux-com will not (but you will need the car pass)

Get your self a new transponder chip and program it with Vaux-com (using the car pass) and all will be fine.

Mark

Modern cars, Its all wizardry and witchcraft

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by David Clayson <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 14, 2014, 8:27 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
David Clayson

Hi David

Tech 11is asking for security access.

You have to connect Tech11 to Vauxhalls TIS and download the authorisation

HTHs

David

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by David Green <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=ukat3707' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 15, 2014, 8:06 am, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"

Thanks for the replies, I have ordered two new transponders and awaiting delivery.

While waiting I scanned for fault codes and read the following codes;

B3055(0)Not Present transponder key problem,

B3060(0)Not present Unknown transponder key (One I replaced a few weeks ago that did work until now).

B3061(0)Not Present wrong transponder key.

B3077(0)Not present wrong transponder type detected.

I checked them against the information on TIS and lead me to A17 control unit faulty. It is still a little unclear to date what is actually the cause as I have two keys, one will start the car where the engine seems to be running in limp mode, yet produces no codes, then after inserting the second key the above codes appear and is immobilised?

At the moment I am wondering if the current problem is because of the replacement transponder a few weeks ago, or the immobiliser has actually failed as the TIS checking procedure is leading me to believe?

Hopefully parts will arrive today and then I can check, confirm or dismiss?

Mark surely I should not have to go out and buy Vaux-Com for this when I have Tech II with the latest software installed should I?

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Lee Mackintosh <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1348' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 15, 2014, 7:32 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
Lee Mackintosh

Tech 2 is a superb tool but to use it to its full potential you need GlobalTIS so that you can gain security access to allow key programmig etc.

Also without it (unless yoou register with GME Infotec i think) you won't beable to update ecu's as when needed or fit new replacements.

This is why Vaux-Com is very handy as it codes keys without the security access requirement.

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by David green <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=ukat3707' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 15, 2014, 8:42 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"

Thanks for replying Lee.Programming seems straight forward following the TECH II program, but when problems occur, this is where understanding and experience comes into play. I don't mind admitting that this is a new area of expertise to me and I am doing much research to gain the best understanding I can.

I have been on GlobalTIS and seen the menus and prices for their services, so long as I don't need to spend £2886 for 365 days worth I'll be OK

I am told OPCOM can program these transponders but I am left wondering whether a code would also be required to use OPCOM with the new blank transponders?

Tomorrow I'll get an immobiliser and see how I go?

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Lee Mackintosh <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1348' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 15, 2014, 9:38 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
Lee Mackintosh

As far as I know all vauxhall's(not sure on newest models) need a security code to access the immobiliser programming functions although vaux-com will extract some but in the main a code Is needed.

So basically without a code I don't see how you will add keys with either vaux-com or tech 2.

I even believe Vauxhall have now tightened up on releasing codes unless a v5 document and identification is supplied so the use of 2nd hand ecu's is difficult if they haven't been reset before removal.

That's why specialists in this field are good to know and worth there money.

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by David Green <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=ukat3707' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 15, 2014, 10:02 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"

Hi Lee,

I have the car pass and other codes, when I coded the keys in a few weeks ago everything worked ok, but the customer advised me on Sunday that the car would not start, later I found that for some reason one of the keys lost communication with the immobiliser and even though I entered the code(s) as requested by TECH II, TECH II came back advising that I needed TIS authorisation to continue.

This never happend a few weeks ago so I am assuming that based on the fault codes read with TECH II and reading through the checking data from TIS, this TIS leading towards a faulty immobiliser I am leaning towards this being the reason why TECH II is saying I need TIS authorisation to continue?

I am not completing a different procedure now than I was a few weeks ago, so something along the lines of the immobiliser must have failed?

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Lee Mackintsoh <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1348' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 16, 2014, 8:21 am, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
Lee Mackintosh

David,

I'm a little confused,

Did you clone the key or program a new one using a diagnsotic tool as they are completely different operations.

You need GlobalTIS to gain security access (online or offline) although i don't really know what happens but i guess it writes some sort of coiding to the tech 2 machine so it knows it can complete security related tasks.

Without this your tech 2 is still useful but not that much better than vaux-com in my opinion.

I read the codes as a faulty transponder chip, so buy either a new key with corect chip in it or buy a transponder chip for around £4 from somewhere like Hickly's or 3DGroup.

If it is an early system (cloning style) then i think yhou need a pre-coded chip to complete the procedure with a diagnostic tool or clone the original key and attempt to add it in using a suitable diagnsotic tool.

That's the only help i can offer as its not really something i know much about.

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by David Green <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=ukat3707' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 16, 2014, 11:24 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"

Hi Lee,

Thanks again for your advice. A few posts back I advised that the car run with one key in and the remaining key had an immobilizer fault issue?

I fitted a second hand transponder to a new key and the remaining key transponder was put into another new key, thus I had two new keys one with the original transponder and one with a replacement transponder. One original transponder was damaged in the old key.

I used TECH II and followed the on screen instructions, both keys were satisfactorily programmed to the immobilizer/ECM. Now whether TECH II cloned a key from one to the other at this point I did not know, but both keys worked ok.

This week having been advised that the car did not start using one of the keys, but started with the second key, the fault codes lead me to the immobilizer being faulty, the checking procedure advises to check for a voltage to the immobilizer and if that is ok and there is still a problem, then the immobilizer is probably at fault?

I asked myself, if the immobilizer is faulty why would one key start the car, maybe in limp mode, but the remaining key would not?

Until today I could not answer that question.

I new previously TECH II required TIS authorization, so today I proceeded to remove the immobilizer and record the number to purchase another unit, however I was still doubtful that the immobilizer was actually faulty?

The customer was not telling me all the facts, but I only found this out at the last moment.

I downloaded the SPS software to communicate with the cars immobilizer and ECM today, refitted the immobilizer in the column, installed two new blank transponders, one in each key, and only then did I find that one key had a transponder missing!!

I programmed the two keys using TECH II and both keys have been successfully programmed again, both keys start the car and it runs ok.

I asked about the missing transponder, the owner said he knew nothing about it being missing, then he advises that his brother used the car to go shopping, and his son also used the car and this is the point when I was contacted and told one key would not start the car.

Looking in the drivers foot well today after finding a transponder missing, I found the missing transponder, it is now obvious to me that the key was accidentally pulled apart and the transponder chip has fallen out into the foot well, and the driver was not aware that this had occurred!!

Was there ever a fault?

Will the transponders roll over in 3 to 8 weeks?

It seems a lot of stress for me for nothing the fault was probably never there in the first place!!

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Tony Bickers <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT5143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 17, 2014, 1:42 am, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Steve Harrison <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1363' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 17, 2014, 9:12 am, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
Stephen Harrison

Another endless diatribe.

The smell of B/S is wafting across from BBA.

Re: Vauxhall Astra G

Posted by Mark Carter <iframe src='https://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/info/user=UKAT1428' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 17, 2014, 3:30 pm, in reply to "Re: Vauxhall Astra G"
Mark Carter

Book yourself on the two day Bosch VSE1 course and get up to speed on basic electrical circuits & how to test them.

Mark

Modern cars, Its all wizardry and witchcraft

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