Posted by Ray Kidder on 5/24/2009, 5:02 pm, in reply to "beyond repentance discussion"
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Jim,
This linked article tells of what seems to be a Protestant view of what the Roman Catholkic Church teaches about the means of salvation.
Is there salvation outside the Roman Catholic Church?
It is true that the Roman Catholic church promotes faith in their religious teachings, just as Protestant denominations promote faith in their own religious teachings. This is from the linked web page:
"As you can see, the bible clearly states that our salvation is through Jesus Christ. Not through any specific church, denomination or organization. This is what the Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons teach. Now we know that the Roman Catholic Church teaches the same thing. This is the clear difference between the Protestants and the Roman Catholics. I have never heard a Protestant say, 'You need to be in the Baptist church to be saved', or 'You need to be in the Methodist church to be saved', etc. That's because being a member of a specific church is NOT what saves you...faith in Jesus Christ and His atoning sacrifice is what saves you."
This quotation seems to echo my post of 5/23/2009, 6:58 am. I remember reading something from Roman Catholicism whereby they describe their church as being like Noah's ark. They do not claim that mere membership saves, but they claim that a refusal to join their church is likened to a refusal to join the body of Christ. Both Protestants and Roman Catholics believe that the body of Christ saves (at lest I think they both believe this, as scripture seems to imply this). The difference is that the Roman Catholic Church seems to believe the body of Christ is their church (which lets people in, and keeps them in, largely through their sacraments and sacramentals), while many Protestants think faith alone is what determines if someone is in or outside of the body of Christ.
When it comes to the need for good works for salvation, many Protestants and Roman Catholic seem to believe there is a correspondence betwen being a saved person and living an upright life, but the Roman Catholic corporate culture seems to point to the work of the church to promote good works as being the root of salvation, while many Protestants claim the root of the salvation is one's faith that produces good works.
I do not feel so sure about what I am writing here, as I suspect much of this is based on people's subconscious beliefs. I am also basing much of what I am writing here on what Eastern Orthodox writers claim about Western Christianity. These EO writers claim that both the Roman Catholics and Protestants have erred by having the filioque, which as reduced the importance of the Holy Spirit in their salvation systems.
I suspect the insertion of the filioque has caused the Holy Spirit to be viewed as something implicit in the saving powers of Jesus. If the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son, and the Son Proceeds from the Father, then it is as though the Holy Spirit is not necessary since the Son is above the Holy Spirit, just as the Father is above the Son.
I suspect that the Pentecostalists are not guilty of dismissing the role of the Holy Spirit, which is good. The Pentecostalists may be a good example of a part of Protestantism that correctly senses the underemphasis of the role of the Holy Spirit, and they have tried to correct this by emphasizing the miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit. OTOH, I suspect that the Pentecostalists are still in error of not recognising the sacraments of Holy Communion and Holy Baptism as being truly sacramental. This lack of sacramental beliefs seems to promote an over-emphasis on other functions of the Holy Spirit.
Also, I thought the term "Protestant" comes from the idea of "members of the Christian Religious who are in a state of protest against Roman Catholicism".
Ray Kidder
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