Posted by Dave Kenady, et al on 6/22/2001, 3:42 pm

Posted by Dave Kenady on 4/7/2001, 10:56 am God is not visible. (1 Tim 1:17) No one has ever seen God. (1 John 4:12) God's ways are past finding out (Romans 11:33). The Bible even says that God is "... dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see... " (1 Timothy 6:16) But somehow, we seem to know God is there. The Bible says the heavens declare the glory of God (Ps 19:1). We see His glory in the heavens (Ps 97:6). But what about actually seeing God. Jacob said that he say God, "And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved" (Genesis 32:30), though the scriptures say he saw a "man". Moses had a conversation with God when he saw a burning bush and the scripture say "And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed." (Exodus 3:2) So Moses was actually talking to the angel of YHWH. Gideon was smart enough to figure out that he was talking to the angel of YHWH (Judges 6:22). Balaam wasn't so smart -- thank God for asses. (Num 22:32-24) My point is this. We know of God because He has communicated to us. Otherwise, there would be no awareness of God by us. In fact, there would be no creation since the Bible tells us that it was by God's very Word that the creation came into existence. Genesis 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. Genesis 1:6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. Genesis 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so. Genesis 1:11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. Genesis 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: Genesis 1:20 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven. Genesis 1:24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so. Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. The creation is the greatest expression of God, anchored in His declaration from the beginning. God spoke and it appeared out of nothing. And the Bible tells us that "Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear." (Hebrews 11:3) So, in as much as this creation is concerned, it is all that which has been spoken into existence by God. And it is only that which has been made manifest by God that we perceive to be the invisible God. And God has made a new choice so that "in these last days [God] has spoken to us in His Son... " (Heb 1:2) John 1:18 puts in very clearly, "No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him." Jesus is "... the image of the invisible God... " (Colossians 1:15) So what does this all tell us? 1)In the beginning, God spoke His word and everything came into existence. 2)When we see God, we are really seeing an expression or manifestation of the invisible, omni-present God. 3)This expression is God, both in that it is in accordance with the will of God and is from God and is that which we can perceive to be God. We cannot otherwise see an invisible, omni-present Spirit that fills heaven and earth. 4)Jesus, in these last days,is now the greatest expression of God there has been. God has chosen, not only that the plan of salvation, but the entire creation has been centered in the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the whole world. Jesus is the focal point of the plan of God AND the manifestation of God in these last days. In a nutshell: 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with [or toward] God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by [it; the Word]*; and without [it; the Word]* was not any thing made that was made. 4 In [it; the Word]* was life; and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. 14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. * - autou; masculine genitive (to agree with Logos which is masculine). Should be translated "it", not "him". ---------- Posted by Gordy on 4/7/2001, 2:48 pm , in reply to "No man Has Seen God at any time, but Jesus has declared Him" Boy Dave, other than a certain difficult little difference :>), we have the same belief! Gordy ---------- Posted by Keith on 4/7/2001, 11:34 pm , in reply to "No man Has Seen God at any time, but Jesus has declared Him" Ya, I've tried to tell Dave that too. I've departed from some CC orthodoxy but aside from that we're still real close. Steve? Isn't this still somewhat clear to you? Is the Trinity or something close to it really the answer, in your opinion? Or do you still have more questions than answers?