Posted by Amir on 5/27/2009, 3:36 pm, in reply to "Re: God's name"
41.212.201.22
"For some reason, you seem to think that it is important that the author place his name on the book."
It is of utmost importance because when u don t know who wrote the book u cannot testify of the integrity of the author.How in the world will u know if he was with or against u if u don t have the least idea of his identity?How can u be so sure that he was not an enemy?
"can you prove through your personal experience that the Koran has any connection to the individual named Mohammad? If we choose to reject the testimony of the people involved in transmitting historical documents, there is no way to prove anything."
Thats a very good question.
Usually information about the past has reached us through oral reports, written reports or archaeological artifacts. For instance, the plays of Shakespeare have reached us through documentary evidence (written words). The stories of Achilles originated as oral reports (words of mouth), which were later recorded by early Greek writers. The report that Buddha used to meditate in a certain posture, has reached us through archaeological remains (pieces of art like statues and engravings).These reports are considered as matters of micro history, which are to be judged in the light of the authenticity of the narrators (in case of oral evidence),the scribes(in case of written evidence) or the artists that created the pieces of art(in case of archaeological evidence).
The Holy Qur'an has reached us through the process of tawatur - historical continuity and perpetuation achieved through transfer from generation-to-generation.It has not been transfered to "some" but to an entire generation.Its authencity hence cannot be questionned because there is no conflict within a generation.If u follow each generation u would see that they all converge to a single point in history.This constitute a proof of its revelation to the Prophet Muhammad.
Let's have a look at a simple example:A scientist gives a long speech about a certain subject in front of an audience.Let's now assume that not a single person in the audience wrote down his speech.If after some time someone tries to give another speech similar to the scientist he would fail.The only way he could have done that provided he did not write down the speech would have been by memorisation.
Therefore, for any claimants to proclaim that their scripture is preserved in purity, they have to provide concrete evidence that the Scripture was written in its entirety AND memorized in its entirety from the time it was revealed to our time, in a continuous and unbroken chain. If the memorization part doesn't exist parallel to the written part to act as a check and balance for it, then there is a genuine possibility that the written scripture may loose its purity through unintentional and intentional interpolations due to scribal errors, corruption by the enemies, pages getting decomposed etc, and these errors would be concurrently incorporated into subsequent texts,ultimately loosing its purity through ages.
Now,Do u possess your scriptures in its entirety BOTH in writing AND in memory from the day of its revelation until our time?
"Iranaeus quotes extensively from the gospels. (AD 120-202)."
This doesn t give a precise date on the datings.
Luke 1:3
Therefore, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, it seemed good also to me to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus
The Theophilus mentionned was either the Patriarch of Alexandria(4th century) or Bishop of Antioch(2nd century).If the author of Luke was the same Luke who was with Jesus(peace be upon him) in the 1st century then how could he be the writer of the gospel?
"It is important to listen to Jesus' words recorded in the gospels. Those who reject
those teachings are in danger of being deceived. Jesus predicted that there would be false Christs and prophets before His second coming."
He also stated:
John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever"
John 15:26 "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, [even] the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me"
John 14:26 "But the Comforter, [which is] the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you."
John 16:7-14 "Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: Of sin, because they believe not on me; Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged. I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, [that] shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew [it] unto you."
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